This site best viewed at 800x600 or greater resolution. Please support Our Advertisers. They make this site possible!

HistoricalTrekking.com
Small Horizontal Row
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in
 CalendarCalendar   LinksLinks 
Beeswax and canvas
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    HistoricalTrekking.com Forum Index -> Message Board
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Moses Milner
User


Joined: 02 Feb 2009
Posts: 51
Location: Salmon, ID
Real Name: Joe Bigley

PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 12:09 pm    Post subject: Beeswax and canvas Reply with quote

I've noticed elsewhere that several folks have spoken of their canvas haversacks and packs being beeswax treated. Can someone tell me the best way to accomplish this? I don't want to waste wax in trial and error.
Thanks!
MM

_________________
Waugh!!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Scott Allen
User


Joined: 25 Jun 2009
Posts: 64
Location: Boonsboro, MD on South Mountain
Real Name: Scott Allen

PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 12:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Moses,

I melt the beeswax in a double boiler and paint it on to a warmed canvas with a brush. Paint until it has absorbed and then I take a hair dryer or heat gun (careful here) and heat it until everything has absorbed again. It is much easier to do before the bag is sewn, but can still be done fairly easily after it is made. Good luck!

_________________
Scott Allen

America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter, and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
~Abraham Lincoln
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
John C
User


Joined: 03 Jun 2007
Posts: 48
Location: Upper Ohio Territory
Real Name: John L Covert

PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 6:34 pm    Post subject: beeswax/canvas Reply with quote

Put come cardboard inside the bag so the sides don't fuse together.

John C
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Loyalist Dave
User


Joined: 21 Aug 2008
Posts: 294

Real Name: David Woolsey

PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 6:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I use a waxed market wallet inside my tumpline pack (rolled blanket) I think it was the video by Mr. Curry, and in the out-takes he opens his roll, and his kettle promptly rolled away..., so I thought why not put a long pouch rolled inside the blanket to hold the "small bits"?

So I stuck the market wallet in my oven at lowest setting..., 170 degrees, and melted the beeswax in my candle dipping kettle, and then took out the bag with a pair of tongs, and dipped it into the wax. the excess wax drained back into the kettle, leaving me with a very water resistant cloth pouch to hold socks, a ration sack, extra mocs, a small kettle, sewing kit, and a few other odd items, that rolls nicely in the center of my blanket when using it for a tumpline pack.

LD

_________________
It's not what you think you know; It's what you can prove
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
hssforge
User


Joined: 05 Jul 2010
Posts: 9

Real Name: rick evans

PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 7:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Dave...that is some good real life knowledge to use.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Black Hand
User


Joined: 16 May 2007
Posts: 132

Real Name: Albert Grobe

PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 11:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I used a cookie sheet covered with tin foil and the oven (~180F). I melted beeswax and poured it over the haversack that was warmed in the oven. I closed the door and allowed the wax to soak in. After 20 or so minutes, I removed the bag from the oven and allowed it to cool making sure the front and back didn't stick together. I then hung it up and used a heat-gun to melt the excess wax, allowing it to drip to and through the bottom of the bag. Once cooled, I worked the bag with my hands to soften it.
Back to top
Find all public pictures posted by %s View user's profile Send private message
virginiaregiment
User


Joined: 01 Apr 2008
Posts: 80
Location: Virginia
Real Name: Jim Mullins

PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 11:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

so.....anyone have documentation for this beeswax impregnation being common in the 18th century?
thanks
Jim
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Black Hand
User


Joined: 16 May 2007
Posts: 132

Real Name: Albert Grobe

PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From: Collection of Voyages and Travels: some now first printed from original ... By Awnsham Churchill 1745
"Turin is noted for making of oiled coats, which, they say, were invented by one Giacomo Marigi; and the fattura of it is still kept as a secret. We only learn'd that they use bees-wax, linseed oil, and verdegrease; and we saw linen cloth stretch'd on wooden frames, and besmear'd with the composition twice on each side, and dry'd in the sun."

From: Anderson's Historical and chronological deduction of the origin of ..., Volume 4 By Adam Anderson 1798
"The exports of Turkey are silk, raw and wrought; carpets, goatshair, and wool; blue, red, and yellow Morocco leather; camels-hair, cotton yarn, dimity, burdets, waxed-linen, shagreen-skins; gums, opium, galls, and other drugs for dying, painting, and physic; mastic, emery, Lemnian bole, pomegranate shells, sponges; dates, almonds, coffee, rhubarb, turpentine, itorax, wine, oil, figs, raisins, mother-of-pearl, box-wood, saffron, wax, &c.—And Turkey takes from England much woollen cloth and stuffs, tin, lead, iron-ware, sugar, and other merchandize of both the East and West Indies; and some think also bullion."

From: Miscellanies upon various subjects By John Aubrey 1784
"...a German gentleman, named Casparus Van Sparr, with whom, in my stay in Germany, about King James's business, I became familiarly known and acquainted, having occasion to build upon an old foundation of a house, wherein his grand-father dwelt at that time, when the said edict was published in Germany, for the burning the said books, and digging deep under the said old foundation, one of the said original printed books was there happily found, lying in a deep obscure hole, being wrapped in a strong linen cloth, which was waxed all over with bees wax within and without, whereby the said book was preserved fair without any blemish."


Spence posted the following quote in a thread regarding haversacks (on another site):

The Pennsylvania Gazette
December 11, 1766

RUN away from the subscriber, living on Barrenhill, in Whitemarsh township, Philadelphia county, on the 2d inst. December, a bound servant man, named George May, a smith by trade, 22 or 23 years old, upwards of 5 feet high, dark complexion, brown eyes, thick lips, broad nose, his knees bent, is a German, but lately come to this province; had on, and took with him, when he went away, a light blue coat, turned, with mohair buttons, a blue torn jacket, with brass hollow buttons, old leather jacket, without sleeves, a Callimancoe ditto, with flowered buttons, a coarse hat, with two buttons, one on the crown, the other on the side, two pair of leather breeches, old light grey stockings, a black crape neckcloth, old shoes, a pair of pumps, with square buckles, four shirts, a waxed linen wallet, and several smith’s tools to shoe horses. Whoever takes up the said servant, and brings him to his master, or secures him, so that his master may have him again, shall have Three Pounds reward, and reasonable charges, paid by BERNARD RAPP.
Back to top
Find all public pictures posted by %s View user's profile Send private message
Black Hand
User


Joined: 16 May 2007
Posts: 132

Real Name: Albert Grobe

PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 10:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

From: An essay on the most effectual means of preserving the health of seamen, in ... By James Lind 1762

"A Suit of Cloaths which is reserved for the Purpose ought then to be put on. And it is to be remembered that Linen Stuffs, especially waxed ones, are preferable to woollen Materials."
Back to top
Find all public pictures posted by %s View user's profile Send private message
Condé
User


Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 233
Location: Mouth of Wilson, VA
Real Name: Tom Condé

PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 11:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good stuff Albert. But dammit. Now we gonna have guys running around wearing sou'westers and looking like the Gorton's fisherman.

_________________
Condé
"Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it." -- Mark Twain

___

Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted. ~Ralph Waldo Emerson

"If you are gonna be dumb you better be tough"

___________

www.condetrading.com
Back to top
Find all public pictures posted by %s View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Black Hand
User


Joined: 16 May 2007
Posts: 132

Real Name: Albert Grobe

PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 11:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tom,
Such is the difficulty of the modern mind-set when applied to older information....
Albert

Another one
From:Advice to people in general, with respect to their health, Volume 2 By Samuel Auguste André David Tissot 1766

"No. 65. Melt four ounces of white wax; add to it, if made in winter two spoonfuls of oil; if in summer none at all, or at most, not above a spoonful. Dip in this flips of linen cloth not worn too thin, and let them dry: Or spread it thin and evenly over them-.

To make a sparadrap, or oil cloth, which is linen, covered with, or dipped in an emplastic substance or ointment, it must be melted over again with the addition of a little oil, and applied to the linen as directed at No.-65.

"White wax" is beeswax that has been bleached by exposing it to air and sunlight.
A "sparadrap" (online dictionary definition) is an adhesive plaster (think medicated band-aid of sorts) or alternately, a waxed cloth used to cover the dead .
Back to top
Find all public pictures posted by %s View user's profile Send private message
Loyalist Dave
User


Joined: 21 Aug 2008
Posts: 294

Real Name: David Woolsey

PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Good stuff Albert. But dammit. Now we gonna have guys running around wearing sou'westers and looking like the Gorton's fisherman.


Ah, and let us not forget the oil-cloth "surtouts" mentioned in Bouquet's papers, which, with the use of yellow ochre instead of "litharge of gold" (red) would make a fisherman's mac.

LD

_________________
It's not what you think you know; It's what you can prove
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Condé
User


Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 233
Location: Mouth of Wilson, VA
Real Name: Tom Condé

PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 5:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Ah, and let us not forget the oil-cloth "surtouts" mentioned in Bouquet's papers, which, with the use of yellow ochre instead of "litharge of gold" (red) would make a fisherman's mac.



As I recall though. There is no evidence that Bouquet's recommendation was ever put into use.

_________________
Condé
"Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it." -- Mark Twain

___

Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted. ~Ralph Waldo Emerson

"If you are gonna be dumb you better be tough"

___________

www.condetrading.com
Back to top
Find all public pictures posted by %s View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
virginiaregiment
User


Joined: 01 Apr 2008
Posts: 80
Location: Virginia
Real Name: Jim Mullins

PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 8:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr. Grobe,
It is nice to see actual documentation posted instead of excuses. Tom C hit the nail on the head with the Bouquet ref. So when it all washes out (hopefully it isn't too early for bad puns), we have a waxed linen wallet in Pa, and some refs from another continent, IMO that puts it in the realm of documented but decidedly not common. Well done. If folks are interested in oil cloth refs there was a recent thread on RevList. From what I have seen, the Anglo answer to wet weather clothing in the third quarter of the 18th century leans heavily on hats and woolens (see the Essay below from the Va Gazette, Cresswell and etc.)
thanks
Jim

Quote:
Essay on Umbrellas, Va Gazette: Purdie & Dixon
Page: 2, Column: 2, 1771-08-29


A Gentleman, of Disntinction from a southern Colony, happened to dine in a large Company a few Days ago, and hearing some Persons complain of the intense Heat of the Sun asked why the Gentlemen in this City did not fall upon Methosd of rendering a more tolerable, and in particular why they did not use Umbrellas to shade themselves. One of the Company expressed his Surprise at this Speech, and said that for his Part he though them very ridiculous, that a good large Hat would answer equally well, and that they looked very effeminate. To this the Gentleman very pertinently replied, "all our Notion s of Propriety and Impropriety are formed by Custom. Should an East Indian appear in our Streets we should gaze with a Mixture of Surprise and Ridicule at his Turban and flowing Robes, while at the same Time we can hardly believe that an Englishman would be much more ridiculous in any Part of Indian in the modern European Dress. In like Manner, should our Ancestors rise from their Graves few of us would know them; or if we did, provided our blind Partiality for the modern Dress continued, few of us would own that we were descended from them. As to the Umbrellas you exclaim against, however ridiculous they may appear to you, Sir, or to any Gentleman in Company, they are looked upon as a greaceful Part of Dress in many Countries, and are often carried upon this Account in those Seasons of the Year when they are in some Measure unneccessary, In India, and in most parts of Asia, a Man would as soon go out of his House without a Shirt as without an Umbrella. In Italy, France, and Spain, they are in every Body's Hands. In the West India Islands, and in most of the southern Colonies, they are so common that none who can afford them ever go without them. But (continued the Gentleman) I am far from recommmending them as Appendages to Dress, or because they are ornamental. Their great Usefullness alone would overbalance all that could be said against their Propriety, even supposing we had lost that Part of th e Argument. They are wide and light, and afford a large Shelter from the Sun. They likewise afford a Shelter from those Summer Showers which are so frequent in theese Climates, and are much to be preferred to great Coats and Rockcloes, which do us more Harm by the Heat they occasion than the Rain would have done. Their Colour, moreover (being generally green) is very friendly to the Eyes. Physicians tell us that a long Train of Diseases foolw from what they call insolation, or long Exposure to the Heat of the Sun, such as Vertigoes, Epilepsy, sore Eyes, Fevers & c. These are all obviated by the Use of the Umbrella. But you say, Sir, that Hats will anser all those Purposes. NOsuch Thing. Custom and Frugality have conspired to die these black, the worst Colour in the World in hot Weather. Besides they are heavy, and too small (let their Brims be ever so broad) to afford a complete Shelter from the Rays of the Sun. You say farther, that they look effeminate; the Ladies use them only. The Ladies wear Shoes, let the men go barefooted. The Ladies defend themselves by various Means from Cold, Rain, Thunder, Fire, & c. Let the Men then abandon themselves to the Rage of each of these terrible Evils, and scorn to look effeminate by guarding against them. Absurd Reasoning! Are not the Men exposed more to the Sun than the Women? Does not their Business call them from home at all Hours of the Day? Are not their Lives of equal (I shall not say of greater) Importance to their Families, and to Society, with the Womens? If all these Things are true, then I see no Reason why the Gentleman should not wear Umbrellas as well as the Ladies." The Gentleman silenced his Opponent with this Speech. The whole Company assented to what he said. Our kind Host, with as much Wit as good Humour, cried out, "Well said Mr. ______ ; my Wine is good; fill your Glasses; my Friend is inspired; and Claret has this Day one the Business."

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Black Hand
User


Joined: 16 May 2007
Posts: 132

Real Name: Albert Grobe

PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 9:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

From:Official letters to the honorable American Congress: written ..., Volume 1 By George Washington, John Carey 1795
"Since writing the above, I saw Mr. * * *, and mentioning that nothing had been found in the tree of Conolly's saddle, he told me there had been a mistake in the matter; that the instructions were artfully concealed on the two pieces of wood which are on the mail-pillion of his portmanteau saddle ; that, by order of lord Dunmore, he saw them contrived for the purpose, the papers put in, and first covered with tin, and over that with a waxed canvas cloth.—He is so exceedingly pointed and clear in his information, that I have no doubt of its being true.—I could wish them to be discovered, as I think they contain some curious and extraordinary plans."
Back to top
Find all public pictures posted by %s View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    HistoricalTrekking.com Forum Index -> Message Board All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You must Register or Log In to post new topics in this forum
You must Register or Log In to reply to topics in this forum
You must Register or Log In to edit your posts in this forum
You must Register or Log In to delete your posts in this forum
You must Register or Log In to vote in polls in this forum
Back to HistoricalTrekking.com
Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group - This site created 11/24/99 by Historical Enterprises.
Photos, Text, Graphics, and Design Copyright © 1999 - Present Historical Enterprises. All Rights Reserved.
Exact Matches Only