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Middlesex Village Trading Co.
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PoBoy
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Joined: 23 Apr 2008
Posts: 20
Location: Idaho
Real Name: Don Kayser

PostPosted: Thu Jan 01, 2009 8:03 pm    Post subject: Middlesex Village Trading Co. Reply with quote

Has anyone used or handled their stuff ? I `ve been looking at one of their guns, but have no reference as to their quality. Opinions seem to flow freely here, how about now ? Let `er rip guys !
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Tsegoweleh
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Real Name: Anonymous

PostPosted: Thu Jan 01, 2009 10:22 pm    Post subject: gun Reply with quote

Oatsayo,
I just sold a MVTC English fowler. Its a good gun. Very shiny like a new penny, But with some work it will be a fine looking gun. Fuctioned very well.
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Trkdriver99
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Joined: 17 May 2007
Posts: 68
Location: Watauga Settlements
Real Name: Ronnie L. Lail

PostPosted: Thu Jan 01, 2009 10:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You will here a lot of different stories on them. They are India made. I have 3, not custom muskets but they fill a need and work very well. The worst problem I have is the heavy trigger. I have bought a lot of them and will buy more. The folks there are great folks to deal with. Pete and Wendy are first rate.
Ronnie

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PoBoy
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Joined: 23 Apr 2008
Posts: 20
Location: Idaho
Real Name: Don Kayser

PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2009 6:09 pm    Post subject: MVTC Reply with quote

I have a "semi-custom" rifle already. The MVTC I was looking at was the SxS Flintlock 20 gauge. I know, not a common gun of the period. But, WOW!!!!!!!! A side by side rock gun has to be the ultimate toy. I would love to do a double on greenheads, or ringnecks with that bad boy! I promise not to take it to a "proper" event. My main concern in asking was about safety, and then about fit & finish, and how the folks were to deal with. If the overall quality of the gun is, say Thompson or CVA, I could live with it. The appearance is spot on.
Come on now, only 2 opinions ? Got to be more than that. Help me decide to go, or not, with it !!!!!! Thanx, Don.
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Singleaction
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Joined: 17 May 2007
Posts: 15
Location: Cullman, Alabama
Real Name: Larry Quattlebaum

PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2009 6:56 pm    Post subject: Rating Weapons Reply with quote

OK PoBoy you asked for it.
For Father's Day my sons purchased me a 1756 Pattern English Sea Service Pistol from Middlesex Village. The service from this dealer was fine. The weapon leaves something to be desired. First, you just about had to use two fingers on the trigger in order to make the cock fall. I tore the lock down to work on the trigger pull (too heavy trigger return spring). One of the screws that should have had a shoulder didn't. The screw threads went all the way to the head. You could see where the threads had been flattened rubbing against the metal. When I was putting the lock back together I had a hard time starting one of the screws. The problem was that you had to lean the screw to make it match up with the threads. Whoever tapped the lock plate did not square the plate up with the tap.
I've never had any of these problems with the Italian weapons that I have owned (several from the 18th C through the CW period). I will not purchase another weapon that is made in India. They may cost a little less but sometimes you get what you pay for.
Hope this helps. Larry
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Michael Archer
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Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 290
Location: West of Fort Pitt
Real Name: Curt Schmidt

PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2009 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How d' ye!

IMHO, the topic of Indian guns versus wall decorators is a partisan argument with lads swearing by them for "price" and "variety" and lads swearing at them for "deviating" from the originals or "wall decorators being rigged to fire blanks or live."

And perhaps, "partisan" is too polite of an adjective at times.

IMHO, I would suggest possibly searching through the various on-line boards- particularly the Civil War boards where previous discussions and wars have already taken place. In that way you can see the pro's and the con's, and hopefully make the most informed decision you can (either way) for yourself.

Otherwise, lads who like them say they are great. While lads who hate them say they are pipe bombs waiting to blow.

Others' mileage will vary...

Michael Archer

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Rod L
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Joined: 16 May 2007
Posts: 226
Location: the Forks of the Yellowstone and Missouri
Real Name: Rod Lassey

PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2009 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MVT arms are best thought of as kits in the white. Right out of the box, they leave something to be desired, but with some work they can made into fairly decent fireams. That, and they offer arms not generally available elsewhere without spending a great deal of money.

I purchased a Ketland pistol from them a couple of years ago. When I intially received it, I was rather disappointed. Very heavy trigger pull, very heavy frizzen spring, blindingly bright lock and barrel, no barrel crown, and plenty of wood left on a light colored stock that had some sort of modern finish. I disassembled the pistol, and went at the stock with rasp and sandpaper, removing the finish and thinning it down. then a coat of stain and oil. The lock springs I heated carefully, drawing a bit of the temper out, which lightened the trigger pull significantly, and made it quit eating flints. I left the mainspring alone. I went at the lockplate with crocus cloth, leaving it bright but not mirror finished. The brass yellowed with handling and age. A few turns at the barrel muzzle with a bit of emory cloth took off the sharp edge.

After I was done, I had a reasonably good copy of a cheap English pistol of the fur trade era--which is what I wanted in the first place. There's still some things I'd change if I could, number one being the cast ramrod thimbles (they should be sheet brass), then they'd accomodate a larger rod. But, overall, I'm pretty happy with what I've got.

Rod

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Gonzales
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Joined: 29 Oct 2007
Posts: 103
Location: Saint Louis
Real Name: Larry Gonzales

PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2009 8:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you do a search on India Bess you will see various comments about them blowing up etc... I have run 70 + balls through my 3rd Model Bess with no complaints. Surprisingly accurate also. They are clunky, need cleaning up and a little tweaking but that stuff is all kind of fun also. Think of them as a "kit" gun.

All in all I would not hesitate to buy anything from them. But that is just my experience.
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Medicine Soldier
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Joined: 16 May 2007
Posts: 21
Location: Black Hills of SD
Real Name: Mark Kirchgesler

PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2009 10:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I currently own 4 guns from MVT. My first was a Bess which is maybe a bit crude and has a stiff trigger pull....but then never having handled and fired an original it may be very authentic in that regard I couldn't say for sure. I have shot and hunted with it using both shot and round ball loads and and I'm fairly impressed with what it will do.

Another is the English Dragoon pistol. Again a bit heavy in the parts makeup but still reliable.

The other two are the matchlock musket and pistol. I had some concerns with the pitol when it arrived. Contacted MVT and was told to return it and they replaced it with no problem. They were just some cosmetic things that I was unsure of and were no safety problems. The musket is a lot of fun to shoot and is a squirrel killer with shot loads. Have also shot round ball and it is capable of some good targets.

And if your thinking of the new double flinter you'll have to get in line. I'm already on the waiting list.

Medicine Soldier
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Ed...Maurer....
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Real Name: Anonymous

PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2009 10:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Funny, we forget that so many of the original Bess' were contract guns and were crap that ended up in the Colonies; am I right? So, may these are actually a more accurate representation than we expect!
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Bogie
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Real Name: Anonymous

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 9:23 am    Post subject: India Guns Reply with quote

Hello,
This is just a classic "you get what you pay for".I would much rather pay more and have a more accurate example from a custom maker.Firing ball is another story,no way would I actually shoot an Indian/Paki gun.Too many horror stories,I was actually present when one of these things errupted last year,not pretty. Pay cheap get cheap,thats the essence of the comparison.The dealer may be fine but the products have serious inherrent issues.
Bog
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Capt. Jas.
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Joined: 30 Aug 2007
Posts: 117
Location: Virginia
Real Name: James Rogers

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 9:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ed...Maurer.... wrote:
Funny, we forget that so many of the original Bess' were contract guns and were crap that ended up in the Colonies; am I right? So, may these are actually a more accurate representation than we expect!


I don't think anyone who has examined the construction of originals with a knowdge of building would agree that they were comparable to an indian gun. It really is a question of getting what you pay for. Those who would buy an indian made gun will praise them. Those who would not consider having one will not have anything good to say about them.

I have seen many of these indian guns up close and I consider them to be a step above the pot metal wall hangers or a good reenacting prop but not an actual firearm. No personal offense to any who own them. They just do not meet my requirements.
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Tsegoweleh
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Real Name: Anonymous

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 12:12 pm    Post subject: gun Reply with quote

Oatsayo,
I have a 1st mod bess. Thats it in the avatar.
I have shot ball and shot from it. Fires every time. I like it better than my 1200.00 custom fowler.
In my opinion the couple of failures are due to operator error.
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Mario
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Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 560
Location: Mohawk Valley, NY
Real Name: Mario Doreste

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 3:47 pm    Post subject: Re: gun Reply with quote

Tsegoweleh wrote:

In my opinion the couple of failures are due to operator error.


There has been 1 documented failure and that was attributed to a blockage in the barrel.

Everyone says that these guns blow up left and right, but there has been only 1 documented case (Rock Ford Plantation, 2007, IIRC)

For folks getting started, they are a viable option. Not perfect, but they work.

I've owned 3 MVTC guns and still own 1 Loyalist Arms musket. All fired live, no problems.

Mario

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Bogie
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Real Name: Anonymous

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 4:21 pm    Post subject: Blow up? Reply with quote

I was at Rock Ford.I was 25 ft. away when it erupted.No blockage,only a black powder charge was used.The barrel was massively defective,incredibly poor workmanship,the seam split like it was cut with a razor.If it happpened to one then there has to be more barrels out there just like it.Why shudder with each trigger pull? Save up and buy a decent gun folks,or have the indy-paki barrel lined by a reputable shop like Bobby Hoyt.
B
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